Jason Wilson & Dick Gaughan
James Strecker: I was astounded to read that, because of the political nature of
some of your material, folk festivals refuse to book a musician of your stature and quality. What brought this restrictive situation about?
Dick Gaughan: In order to be completely accurate, that should read “some” folk
festivals, usually the larger ones. There are still some festivals and venues which have remained closer to the founding principles of the folk song revival and which look for some depth of engagement beyond passive consumption.
JS: I’ve read how you advocate responsibility and active participation, not passivity, as the duty of citizens in a society. Well, you have Cameron in London and we have Harper in Ottawa, so what is our responsibility now as these Conservatives reshape our political systems in their retrograde image? What specifically can we do?
DG: Having spent much of my life refusing to do what anyone else wanted me to do, I don’t feel qualified to start lecturing anyone else on what they should or shouldn’t do. The only suggestion I can make is to develop a solid bullshit detector, particularly when considering the pronouncements of politicians.
JS: You’ve commented about “Now Westlin Winds,” words by Robbie Burns
and sung often by you, that “This is the perfect song. It says everything it is conceivably possible to say about anything.” On the internet, people call your take on the song “sublime,” “an unbelievably perfect performance,” and “food for the soul.” Are there any other songs that almost do it all for you?
DG: I’ve never been able to find one. Some come close, but none do for me what that one does.
JS: Several musicians have told me of their concerns about music nowadays, how it is musically simplistic, how it is clichéd in all ways, how its lyrics address nothing but oneself, and how its audience is so uncritical and accepting of it. What can we do about this musical dead end?
DG: In a world of meaningless music, the most constructive course is for musicians to write and play music which has some meaning.
JS: Once, at one of your gigs, I asked a musician known for his
expertise on several instruments, what he thought of your performance
and he said, with a hint of awe in his voice, “I don’t know how he gets
all those notes.” If you were another musician listening to Dick
Gaughan, what would you say about his playing of guitar?
DG: To me, technique or technical ability is simply a means to an end,
it is not an end in itself. It is certainly a part of the craft of being a musician to develop one’s skills to the best of one’s ability. However, without meaningful context it simply becomes an exercise in cleverness. Technique which has no purpose other than saying “Look at the clever things I’ve trained myself to do” is,
to me, a complete turn-off. As I get older, I get much more interested in what someone has to say and much less so in how cleverly they say it.
JS: Your recording of Dominic Behan’s “Crooked Jack” resonates deeply
with me, partly because working in a factory almost ruined my father’s
fingers for playing the button accordion. Could you name a few of the
working class songs that reached deep into you when you first heard them?
DG: Much of what I heard growing up could be called “working class songs” but no such distinction was made back then. They were simply “songs”.
JS: Several singers have told me how at some point they realized that they had become quite good at what they were doing and as a result felt an inner compulsion to move into a different form of creativity. Any comment?
DG: When I feel confident enough that I’ve “become quite good at what
I do” I’d be able to answer that properly.
JS: In writing a song, how does one achieve a balance between message
and artistry? How does one make points about a subject which perhaps
angers one or causes one to despair, without resorting to an angry rant,
say about suffering or social injustice or fascistic politicians?
DG: Back to Brecht again, who expressed the opinion that “good politics never excuse bad art”. I accept completely that there are places where a slogan or rant are entirely appropriate, such as rallies or marches, but I don’t think a concert stage is one of them.
JS: In terms of how you see yourself as a person, what does Scotland mean to you? What, for you, does the issue of “Scottish identity” mean?
DG: It simply means to me “Who I am”. It’s neither better nor worse than any other culture, simply the one I understand and grew up within and which is the foundation for everything I do.
JS: In one of the Brit papers a few years ago –I think it was The Observer- there was an article on the current trend to stigmatize the poor. What other groups are there these days who are stigmatized and unfairly stereotyped?
DG: Essentially, most vulnerable groups which do not have the power to fight back.
JS: I know that you have had your share of breakdowns and that you lost your voice once for a whole year, so what did you learn as a result?
DG: That there is more to my existence than simply a voice.
JS: What impact on your future life did your difficult childhood have and what did it teach you that was useful for you as an adult?
DG: It didn’t occur to me that it was any more difficult than any other working class kid where I grew up. It was only when I reached my teens that the wide gulf between haves and have-nots became clear to me, clear enough that I wanted to do what I can to challenge it.
JS: You have said: “We live in a time that the ruling class maintains its power by a complete stranglehold on all elements of culture. Music’s been diluted down, particularly popular music which is part of the fashion industry essentially. It all has to be about me me me and my broken heart …everything’s been narrowed down to a limited range of topics.” You have also said that in 1978 you “walked away from RCA records” after “I had one small taste of the music industry and got the fuck out as fast as I could.” How would you remedy this situation which limits and distorts culture?
DG: Provide musicians with a way of making a decent living which doesn’t involve hawking ourselves to record companies.
JS: I want you to know that your collection “A Handful of Earth” is very special in my life and an album I often recommend to others. So, for a final question, how does Dick Gaughan feel about having meaningful impact on the many who value him?
DG: I never pay a great deal of attention to whether or not what I do has any deep lasting effect upon others. It is gratifying when it seems to do so, but it is not the main purpose. Becoming too motivated by audience response tends to result in one taking oneself too seriously.